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Post by activereality on Feb 12, 2020 13:46:23 GMT
I've seen people put a piece of glass down on spoil board also to help tramming. 6" should do it, I don't think mine is much bigger that that, maybe its 9" with the 2 arms. But my spindle can take a 3/8" rod that I attach the arm to. Not sure of your capacity. I can go up to 1/4"- as I have a collet for that (got a cheap set from amazon). I'll have to see if I can take a look at the clamp and indicator to test the runout further. Hmm, After i surface, if i still have any major issues or concerns, i might look for a small piece of glass to test on as well. Thanks for the help again Joe!
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Post by activereality on Feb 14, 2020 5:04:56 GMT
Well, having trouble creating a 16x16 facing program Will be trying to play with it more tomorrow, but I couldn’t get the first program to run on via ugs, and then a second try - of a 15x15 face operation- gave me errors when trying to save from f360.
So no real progress today. Hoping to have the surface operations done over the weekend. And maybe do a ‘first real project’ as well.
Till then.
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Post by activereality on Feb 15, 2020 2:48:04 GMT
Alright, finally figured it all out. I had to play with the board size in f360 - since I am close to mechanical limits of machine and already had the board in place on the machine ( did not do the best job at getting the SP centered onto the bed haha). BUt I was able to fenagle it enough to get it set up! Running the program now - test run. Quick question for you guys: Fusion spit out a surface speed of 2984.51 ft/min with a cutting feed rate of 39.3701 in/min and feed per revolution of 0.0010961 in. As the Millright app (which i am loving by the way) does not have a 1" surface/face bit, I do not know what speeds I might need to override fusion with. This does not _look_ too aggressive, however, that is a large surface area for the bit and I do not want to 'overly stress' the CK on it's first harder job haha. Do we have another resource for speeds/feeds available? Such as the variables or another calculator that I could reference? Once I know the calcs, I could write another app to work on the larger bit - although i am certain there is more to a bit than just one variable - so I am in _that_ curve (are trying to be haha). If all goes well with my surfacing attempt tomorrow, then i'll run MILLRIGHT text job, then who knows!? I do need to make some hold down clamps but I also probably need to calibrate the steps on the motors. well, off to look that up now
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Post by Bruce on Feb 15, 2020 6:13:11 GMT
Just start out slow and ramp it up faster if it looks like it can handle it. You can increase/decrease the feed rate on the fly if you want in UGS.
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Post by activereality on Feb 15, 2020 15:33:12 GMT
Thanks Bruce, Thats a great feature in UGS, I'll have to play with that - is there a tutorial or doc list for ugs? Been looking for some and finding slim pickings on that. On another note, I also got these drawn up this morning - based on the ones i received with the CK:(still working my way through f360, so slow going, but progress!!!) I'll test these out and, when i start in aluminum, probably make a few different holder/clamps types. I saw some similar to this, with an added 'wedge' piece to place on the off hand side. I like that idea, but seems like it would take a big chunk of aluminum. So might make that from a hard wood or something and the physical clamp from aluminum. Meh idk what I am doing here haha. I have note even made a real project yet and I am already loving the versatility of this machine. While , like most subjects, the more you know the more you can cheat (find other ways to fo the same thing), I'll be working through the 'Wow, it can do that!" and 'Wow, that's a thing?!" for a bit i think haha.
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Post by activereality on Feb 15, 2020 21:25:04 GMT
Well, a few trials and errors later! Got the board faced: Yeah yeah yeah, i need to actually tram the spindle, but don't have the gear to do that yet, so gonna suffer till i do. Then got some clamps out, got a work piece secured and made some calibration cuts- followed by some clamps! They aren't perfect, but they'll do for now! The Spoil board worked great, very easy to get things maneuvered around and secured. For the Spindle - I think the top is 'leaning' towards the front of the bed. There is a 'lip' at the front edge of cuts. I think for now, until i start to get into finer details or less 'tolerant' projects, i should be good. But this will get fixed.... eventually. I will see if i can find a 1/4 tramming tool, or maybe find someplace to make one for me (really just need to be straight, have two holes squarely drilled, then can start trying to adjust it on my own.
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jms
Full Member
Posts: 168
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Post by jms on Feb 15, 2020 21:47:13 GMT
glad to see you moving along.
Joe
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Post by activereality on Feb 16, 2020 2:01:22 GMT
glad to see you moving along. Joe Trying!! Will have some small projects done tomorrow. Now need to start planing some useable stuff : need a dust boot, larger electronics enclosure, to house all electronics currently used- using a spindle, so need a housing for power supply, and e stop switches, and need a pause switch and place to mount the spindle rheostat as well. It’s gonna get there!!
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jms
Full Member
Posts: 168
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Post by jms on Feb 16, 2020 12:09:49 GMT
this is how I set up mine. Mounted electronics box onto side of cabinet. 1.5" holes drilled in back sides for wires and water lines going to a small tank with pump.
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Post by activereality on Feb 16, 2020 13:56:33 GMT
this is how I set up mine. Mounted electronics box onto side of cabinet. 1.5" holes drilled in back sides for wires and water lines going to a small tank with pump. hmm, I like that alot! Your Spindle is VFD controlled as well (just remembering you were talking about that on another thread i think). I might do something similar as you, and just include my Spindle knobe protruding from the top as well. Since there are hold and resume circuits as well, I might throw in some switches for those as well - as I assume we can 'hold' a job, move it around a bit, then hit resume and it will travel back to the hold-origin and continue the job. This to accompany an E-Stop button as well, of course haha. Just need to look into if these need to be constant or intermittent switches. This may be a project that I put out a bit more and complete some more planning. As my concept is to have a 'one shot, one kill' kind of box and have everything electronic (that is not affixed to the CK) in it - to do this, I would like to extend my wires first- and also want to install some limit switches for the (-) axes. I see there are a few crimp and connector kits out there, which is perfect, so I would be able to make some ~2ft extensions for everything and give me a lot more room to maneuver. Then this leads me also to - I want to put this in some sort of enclosure - even if it is an open front - I want to keep most of the dust inside. So might make a partial 4 sided enclosure that I can build off of later. So would have bottom, sides, back and a partial top (to install a light of some sort- and act as a mounting boom for a dust hose). Surfacing the SP yesterday was nasty - but i kept up with it. The subsequent pieces were a bit easier to keep up with, but if i can set it up so i do not _need_ to hold something, that would be better. So, my next couple pf project might be showing themselves. Next: - Solve the tram issue - I am thinking i can just cut a tram tool. They are simple enough. Run it in 3 operations maybe? - Cut the frame of it from a larger piece of wood (so sides would be much straighter than stock wood) - turn the work piece on its side, and drill the through holes - turn back in it's side to cut the bolt holes to 'clamp' the bit and tool extension rod (probably just another bit for now) - I might run down to HF today and take a look around for a cheap indicator After this, I'll re-surface the SP - gotta figure out a way to reduce the step down for that cut, cause i just need a couple thousandths difference.... I hope! i also might just go ahead and do a couple of small projects today. I want to cut a damned mill-right text file. The might run a name or two in different pieces of wood. Then might even try cutting out an EGA (kill!) real quick. I think the last will be the ultimate test to the current machine set up. After this tramming I think I might have to let this thread die a little, until I start working on the electronics relocation and enclosure. But... more to come!
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Post by activereality on Feb 17, 2020 1:29:44 GMT
Well. Found some more interesting stuff about F360- other than aggravation haha!
I got a tramming tool built and started creating tool paths for it. When I got to a slot cut into it from the sides (I’ll post some pics later) I was unable to get a tool path to cut into it.
It would generate for a connected hole (for mounting a bolt to it for the spindle or the top deck’ measuring surface.
I eventually figured out- I was cutting a 0.125 slot with a 0.125 bit- fusion did not like this. So I cheated and told it I am using a smaller diameter bit.
I am pretty sure there should be a way to offset this- maybe some sort of ‘cut more material’ setting. Matter of finding it now.
I’ll run this part in 3 operations.
1: cut the through holes for the ‘clamping bolts’ 2: use those holes (and probably some four sided tape if both holes don’t match up) to hold the work, then cut out the part - 2d contour i think 3: turn the part sideways- use clamps forcing from the sides, and double sided tape- to cut the slots and through holes for the stock to attach to the spindle and then the stock to extend to the bed.
Was pretty proud of myself so I started to get a bit into the collet when I discovered some movement in my Z axis. The bottom wheels were very loose!
So, broke out the 8mm stuff again, took the bottom z-plate off, rotated the z down to get to those and readjusted the v-wheels. While in there I also made sure all the wheels through bolts and nuts were snug. Once I got all the movement out, got put all back together.
Quick note: the damned coupler separated and let the z-plate fall into my hand (I had removed the spindle to do this and was glad after this happened haha). Scared the crap out of me! Haha. Quick google search found that this happens and should not be too worrisome. Once all back together, I ran a homing cycle, then Ran the z up and down a few times with no issues. So I think all is well.
I also gave the gantry and other axes some good shakes to see if anything else had loosened up. I’ll start making it a point to double check things at regular intervals- need to make some sort of maintenance log for these things.
Next up, actually run the part tomorrow! This will be kinda cool, as I am making a part to make the CK better than it already is! I can’t wait to see where this rabbit hole goes!!
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Post by activereality on Feb 17, 2020 11:51:49 GMT
Pics as promised: tramming tool. this one will be made of mdf. One end to connect a bit to the spindle and the other to measure to the deck (whatever surface that might be). This slot (for both sides) was what was giving me so much trouble: I am already liking this design, and will test it out to see how good it really comes out. I might see if i can add a slot to the hole extending from top to bottom - so I can maybe install an indicator - but i need to get one to try out fitment and figure that out. Worst case, I could maybe add it on top or bottom of the tool. The tricky part here will be making sure to index the machine back to the part after each operation and move. For that, I am using the center top of the part each time. This is a plane that can be more easily measured to, since the edges will have radius. We shall see how it comes out! I am thinking future iterations to be double the length and run an indicator at both ends, connecting to the spindle in the center. That will be down the road - but I already started roughing the design in F360.
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Post by activereality on Feb 18, 2020 3:36:03 GMT
Well, got it cut! It came out pretty good. I need to make sure of my work holding though. When I had the cut out part on its side- for the slots- it moved ever so slightly. Nothing went bad, and I was able to pause, move spindle out of the way and re-secure the work. I also need to make sure to not cut into my damned spoil board- I don’t want to have to redo it every few weeks if I can avoid it haha. No pics: I threw the new tramming tool on the machine- leveled a piece of glass and got the spindle mostly trammed. Y axis is within 0.003” and X is 0.009” (after the 4th time dismantling the z plate - that was good enough for now haha). To get the variation, I would zero the z on one side and the swing it to the other. I’ll eventually have some indicators and I’ll remake this tool with two indication ends to attach to the spindle in the middle. I want to make this from aluminum some day as well. All in all, a good project and nice outcome. While I have more plans for this machine- enclosure, dust management, electronics relocation, probably upgraded spindle and laser, e-controls box (estop/pause/resume switches). I think this kind of ends the ‘assembly’ for now. Those projects will probably be here in the assembly threads, but be separate from this one. This has been a super fun build and something that was literally a couple of years in the making!! Thank you everyone who pitched in to assist with knowledge and to Derek and crew for getting this thing running!! Thanks all!
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jms
Full Member
Posts: 168
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Post by jms on Feb 18, 2020 12:54:10 GMT
If you could get some 3/8" rod, turn down 2" of it to .250 to fit in your collet, then attach indicator arms to it and use dial indicator it would be much more accurate, I would be afraid the wood is heavy and slightly leaning down. The small indicators are more accurate (non-digital) but more expensive. But I would wait till you do your upgrades you spoke of.
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Post by activereality on Feb 18, 2020 13:49:44 GMT
If you could get some 3/8" rod, turn down 2" of it to .250 to fit in your collet, then attach indicator arms to it and use dial indicator it would be much more accurate, I would be afraid the wood is heavy and slightly leaning down. The small indicators are more accurate (non-digital) but more expensive. But I would wait till you do your upgrades you spoke of. Hey Joe! Yeah, I was worried about that as well. So I ran the bolt through the vertical place of the tool, then secured it with a washer and nut, then put the cross bolt through to secure it in place. After install i could get it to deflect, but i had to put some force into it. So, i think for now, this should be good. When you say 'small indicators', are you just talking about a dial indicator? Or a specific size? I plan on getting one, eventually, and just figure I would get a mid-tier analog indicator anyway. I think the one I looked at previously had a 1" travel. Yeah, I stepped back and looked at what i was doing, and I saw myself chasing some things that would ultimately be altered in the future - for some of those upgrades. I think I will take a bit more time to make sure i can get it as close as possible - although i need to research and find the expectations of the CK and what I should think of as 'good'. Not to sound bad or anything - I am already impressed with this machine, and it has exceeded my expectations of a table top, hobby level CNC. With others working in harder materials and the level of workmanship put into this kit, I think I need to adjust my concept of 'good' up a bit haha. Great problem to have though! Maybe some of the CK guys can chime in on this. To what level of accuracy should I be aiming for? From the Machinists in the crowd: At what point am i really just chasing drastically reduced diminishing returns from the 'accuracy' side of things? Is there a 'you should call it good' point in this level of machine? Well, if all goes well, I'll have some more projects up soon!
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